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Author: shisraelit
Date: 13-07-2013, 01:42
Edited by: shisraelit
at: 13-07-2013, 01:44

I made this topic for speak of 2 nations that in the lasts years have improved a lot in the european cups.

This year azerbaijian has started very well because all 3 teams are qualified at the el 2nd round qualifications:khazar lankaran has defeated silema wanderers from malta 1-1 away and 1-0 at home,inter baku has defeated mariehamn from finland 1-1 at home and 2-0 away,and qarabag,one of my favourite team in eastern europe,has defeated metalurg skopje from macedonia with a double 1-0.

For the second round i expect an elimination from khazar against maccabi haifa,but tromso-inter baku and qarabag-piast are on the paper very balanced,with some luck we will have 2 azeris teams in elqr3.
In the 2nd round of clq neftchi start favourite against skenderbeu from albania.

For kazakhstan elqr1 have finished well,because irtish pavlodar surprise all and defeated levski sofia,aktobe(my favourite team in eastern europe,i follow this team in qualifications since 5-6 years and i think early or late they will qualify for cl or el groupstage)has defaeated gandzasar(a weak team from armenia...)with a double 2-1,the only team eliminated was astana(0-1,5-0 from botev plovdiv,they have saved the bulgarian honour...)

In the next round i think aktobe is favourite against hodd,a nice team from 2nd division norway and irtish-siroki(on the paper a bosnian team but in fact they are croatian) is a 50-50 matc

In cl bate start favourite against shakter karaganda,but who knows...

Author: AnelZ
Date: 13-07-2013, 05:02
Edited by: AnelZ
at: 13-07-2013, 05:05

@shisraelit
"(on the paper a Bosnian team but in fact they are Croatian)"

If you are going that way, then please refer to Barcelona as an Catalonia club; Real Sociedad as Basque club; Narva Trans, Sheriff, Tiraspol and Daugava as Russian clubs (I'm not sure for Shakhtar and Metalist Kharkiv from Ukraine); Rubin Kazan as Tatar club and Anzhi as Dagesti club. And not to talk about Belgium clubs. Btw. these are only clubs who qualified for this season of European competition and some more are coming from very mixed region so I wasn't sure and have left them out.

It is true that Široki Brijeg comes from a municipality of 25000 population in Bosnia and Herzegovina which is almost 100% Croatian, but if you don't make differences for the clubs I mentioned above, then, please, don't do that for Široki Brijeg also. They are a Bosnian club supported by Croats which in my eyes don't make them a Croatian club, no matter how many Croatian flags you may see on and around the stadium. The term "Bosnian" is for all ethnic groups in Bosnia and Herzegovina, the term "Bosniak" is used for the Muslim population.

Cheers

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: JohnHarts Date: 13-07-2013, 14:28	To be honest, the support base for most clubs in Latvia and Estonia would be more ethnic Russians, rather than Balts. I think this is mainly down to ice hockey being much more popular here and also to the respective national teams not doing well enough to inspire interest.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 14-07-2013, 01:04	AnelZ-yes,you are right,siroki gives points to bosnian coefficent and play in bosnian championship,but i wanted to say that the spirit of siroki is croatian. However i think that in your country almost all matches there is much tension and incident,or i m wrong?

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 14-07-2013, 01:31	Kind of off topic, but speaking of Croatian-supported clubs in other countries... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_Croatia Check out the team roster.

Author: Talesin
Date: 14-07-2013, 12:24

Well i think you underestimate the norwegian teams, or overestimate the azerbadsjan and kazakhstanian teams.
Tromsø is clear favourites vs Inter Baku. In theory theres a huge difference in level between the teams.
But seeing how Tromsø is very up and down with how they play recently, i would not bet on Tromsø taking it.

As for Aktobe vs Hødd, Hødd is a first division team, currently amongst the top teams and only 3 points away from the second place that gives a promotion.
Offcourse nobody in Norway expects Hødd to manage anything in EL, and Aktobe is obviously huge favourites here.
Also i'm not sure how the fact that they've had summer vacation until now, will affect the team.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Deneverember Date: 14-07-2013, 14:53	I think Siroki Brijeg is a bosnian team, if it wanna be a croatian team,the team must play the croatian league. Example Swansea and Cardiff City is welsh team, but play in the Premiership. Derry City playing at the irish league but the city located in Northern Ireland. TNS is located in England but play in welsh league.

Author: agram
Date: 15-07-2013, 18:29

it's very simple about siroki.
the club plays in bosnia and herzegovina's premier league, so it is bosnian team. they did not showed any tendency to join croatian first division (or to join any other croatian division).

although, most of the siroki's players are croats by nationality (bosnian croats or croats from croatia), and club does not have, and probale will never have in future, players from other 2 bosnian ethnical groups (serbs or bosniaks).

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 16-07-2013, 00:33

I expect Aktobe to advance vs. Hodd. It might not be easy, but they shall overcome, experience will be a big factor. I hope Irtysh kept their form and that might just be enough vs. Siroki Brijeg. I suspect it`ll be very close, but after Levski, my expectations were raised.
Shakhter Karagandy have little chance vs. BATE, but I won`t be utterly upset if they prove me wrong. (I like BATE as well.)

For the Azeris the task looks somewhat harder. I don't give Khazar Lankaran a realistic chance vs. Maccabi Haifa, but please, prove me wrong, I`ll be very happy! Inter Baki might have a chance vs. Tromso, but I think they're the underdog. Still, here I can imagine an upset.
Qarabag have about 50% chance in my opinion, and I very much want them in the 3rd round. I count on their experience and their capacity to deliver when it counts.

Neftchi Baki have the best chance, more than 50% vs. Skenderbeu Korce in the CL, I expect them to advance.

Author: dzomba
Date: 16-07-2013, 13:24
Edited by: dzomba
at: 16-07-2013, 13:39

Whether Siroki Brijeg is bosnian or croatian clubs, first some facts.

Bosnia was croatian independent kingdom in middle ages, existing together with other croatian kingdoms, but not united with them.
Terms Bosnia and bosnian were forged by croats from that region, to describe themselves and their kingdom.
Term Herzegovina was also forged by croats, for one half-autonomous region at the time.

These lands were mainly croatian (not strictly according to modern borders of Bosnia, but generally, more or less).
The fact is that these lands are not croatian anymore, since now there are no croats there at all.
The fact is that part of Bosnia and Herzegovina is still croatian.
Here i have to explain that term croatian has nothing to do with term Republic of Croatia. Term croatian explains belonging to croatian nation, croatian people, not to croatian state. Croatian nation is wider than croatian state, and also wider in meaning.

The fact is that Bosniaks started calling themselves so only 20 years ago. Before that they were not calling themselves Bosniaks nor Bosnians, but differently.
Before that Serbs and Croats from this region called themselves Bosnians and Herzegovinians, without differentiation. Before it had only geographical meaning, without political meaning.
Things have changed since your nation started calling yourself Bosniaks. From that point on, Serbs and Croats no more identified themselves with the name Bosnian, and stopped using it for describing themselves. From that point on they started using only terms Serb / Croat, eventually still using term Herzegovinians. These are facts.

Now my view.
It's absolutely correct to refer to Siroki Brijeg as croatian club. Absolutely. Because as i explained, term croatian does not mean belonging to croatian state, but rather to croatian nation, which is a wider term. It's also absolutely correct to refer to Siroki Brijeg as Bosnian and Herzegovinian club, since it belongs to Bosnia and Herzegovina state.
But you are not right to enforce only one view, only your view, and forbid other forum users to use another reference. You are jumping toward other users for no reason, and that made me jump toward you. You simply provide fake information. You pretend to "correct" them by enforcing your and only your view, as the only acceptable, which is not true.
And if someone is as picky as you, then i must be equally picky, and say that saying Bosnian club is abolutely incorrect, for the reasons i mentioned (Instead you should use precise term: Bosnian and Herzegovinian), because your nation started monopolizing terms Bosniak, Bosnian, making other two nations giving up the name. And it's absolutely fine, since they already have their names. If you 20 years ago decided to call yourselves Bosniaks or Bosnians, whatever, i have nothing against. You have the right to chose your name. Regardless of the fact that it was forged by croats long ago, it's absolutely irrelevant. Your name is the one with which you identify yourself with, no matter of it's origin.
I do respect your nation, but i have to say a word about disrespecting my nation.
So when you refer to Siroki Brijeg you can only say Bosnian and Herzegovinian club, it's absolutely wrong to call it bosnian club, since from 20 years ago term Bosnia got another meaning. So if you request other forum users to be precise, then first you should be precise, and you are not. Intentionally i am affraid.

I am absolutely not interested in developing useless political discussion here, but i had to warn other forum users that what you say is simply not correct. I let everyone decide their view, i let them choose terms they want to use, but you do not allow them to have their own opinion, instead you enforce yours as the only one. Unacceptable.

For comparison with other countries:
Someone above said Swansea is a welsh team, but playing in England. He didn't say Swansea is an English team but located in Wales. I admit that i much more often heard first version, than second. I also often heard Athletic Bilbao baskian club. Nobody negates they do compete in Spanish liga, nobody negates they do represent spanish league and flag, but they remain baskian club, and there is nothing wrong with referring to them as baskian club.
There was a talk that Celtic and Rangers will join premier league. If they did, they wouldn't stop being Scottish clubs above all, regardless of where are they competing.
Clubs from Oceania and elsewhere which compete in French cup do not become french clubs because of it. They remain martinique, reunion etc clubs.
Shkendija is albanian club, despite the fact it competes in Macedonian league, and gathers points for macedonian football federation. It changes nothing.
There must be Kurdish (or Kurd!?) clubs which compete in Turkish league, which compete in iranian league, which compete in iraqian league. they are all kurdish clubs, and they can be referred as such, despite the fact they can be also referred as Turkish, iranian or iraqian.

Administrative borders change, but belonging remains to the people who inhabit the region, no matter who is the ruler. Croatian lands remained croatian even in Habsburg Monarchy, under Venice, or in Yugoslavia. Cities, too, clubs too, they all remained primarily croatian, because the meaning of this term is much, much deeper than that made on belonging to administrative borders.

So, in the future, please let other users express their own view, let everyone have his own opinion, or i will react every time you enforce your view as the only one. I won't refer to this anymore, because i wrote this not for you, but for others.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: putje Date: 16-07-2013, 20:53	Last line in first reaction: "In cl bate start favourite against shakter karaganda,but who knows..." Look out now. Nothing decided yet, but to go and win in Borisov! That team played 5 seasons in a rope European Groups of wich 3 Ch L.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: mspm89 Date: 16-07-2013, 21:02	Not to mention that BATE was the only team to defeat the champions Bayern Munich in last season's CL. Surprising result indeed. I wonder if there will be more surprises in this round.

Author: AnelZ
Date: 16-07-2013, 21:24
Edited by: AnelZ
at: 16-07-2013, 21:30

@Dzomba - I respect your opinion, but again we will never agree on many stuff you have said in that post. Already in the beginning when saying that the term Bosnian was coined by Croats as a regional identification for them and that during the middle ages Bosnia was a "Croatian independent kingdom" I already see that we will have hard time to agree on facts because I (and many others) consider them utter nonsense. You can read the same (and I mean really the same) stuff said by Serbs that the term Bosnian was coined by them as a regional identification for the Serbs who live there and that during the middle ages Bosnia was a Serbian kingdom which I (and again many others) also regard as nonsense, although I do agree that parts (and only sometimes the whole) nowadays Bosnia and Herzegovina was divided between Serbia and Croatia during only some periods of history. With saying those things on the beginning of your post you are also imposing and forcing others to form an opinion as yours. So better we leave this argument behind us then to spark something I and I believe you too don't want on this forum.

For Široki Brijeg and Zrinjski (and some other "smaller" clubs), I regard them as Bosnian clubs created (not all), supported and led by Croats and that is all. In the end, it comes almost to the same as you said.

Btw. we didn't called us "Bosniaks" mainly because only from 1971 we were allowed to call us at least "Muslims by nationality", before that we didn't had any choice but to choose something different, basically many were forced to declare as Serbs/Croats while many other were categorized as "Others". We may would be able to identify as Bosniaks before the war if only Džemal Bijedić didn't died (or was it only an accident?) in that unfortunate airplane accident as he was the most probable successor of Josip Broz Tito. If it wasn't to him, we may have never been able even during Yugoslavia to at least call us "Muslims by nationality".

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 16-07-2013, 21:55	``Shakhter Karagandy have little chance vs. BATE, but I won`t be utterly upset if they prove me wrong. (I like BATE as well.)`` Never been happier when proven wrong!

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: jojo Date: 16-07-2013, 22:56	Will you also blame each other for starting the war? I really can't wait for that...

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 17-07-2013, 01:36 Edited by: shisraelit at: 17-07-2013, 01:37	And so shakter karaganda make the upset of the evening and win in belarus against bate borisov...wow...incredibly...but i still think it will be tough for shakter next week...however this match(and not only) prove that football in kazakhstan is growing up well...now we will see irtish and aktobe thursday.

Author: dzomba
Date: 17-07-2013, 08:44
Edited by: dzomba
at: 17-07-2013, 09:19

I don't care who is learning which history. I know what is true. I do not forbid anyone to learn fake history.

What i talked about is about the beginnings of our states. After "big moving of nations" and collapse of the roman empire, first kingdom in Bosnia was croatian (before 1000. year). In fact, first croat country was formed more southern east than current croatian state. It was formed inside, not on the coast, and didn't include Istria, Rijeka, islands and today northern Croatia, but did included most of Bosnia.
Original serb country was formed eastern, around Kosovo and Nis, not around Belgrade, closer to Romania nad Bulgaria, and it didn't include Bosnia, at least not major part. Later serbian kingdoms did included great parts of Bosnia, nobody negates that. Borders changed many times, from one side to another.
During all history there was a constant pressure from south east so all nations moved from southeast to northwest, that's how croats slowly left parts of Bosnia and moved to Istria and islands and to the northern croatia, and that's how Serbs lost Kosovo and inhabited Vojvodina and parts of Bosnia and Croatia by moving to the north-west, as all other nations around did.

But discussing history here is very wrong. I only had to reply you when you said my facts are not true. Yes, they are. But i don't care whether someone is learning true or fake history.

The main point is, referring to serbian or croatian clubs as bosnian clubs is very wrong, since from 20 years ago (ex-Yu) Muslims started calling themselves Bosniaks or Bosnians. Since then term bosnian means (exclusively) belonging to muslims. So Siroki is either Herzegovinian club or croatian club, but can never be bosnian club.
You can use term Bosnian and Herzegovinian, but then you must apply it to all. If Siroki Brijeg cannot be croatian club, then Sarajevo also cannot be bosnian club, instead then all clubs are Bosnian and Herzegovinian.
Again, let's not discuss anymore, but do not jump toward other users when they express different view than yours. I have never did that on this forum.

This all useless talk started when you for no reason jumped on shisraelit, when he hasn't said anything wrong, nothing at all, and you for no reason started to "correct" him. For no reason.

Muslims identify themselves with term "Bosnian", croats identify themselves with the term "Herzegovinian". It's wrong to use one term for another group, to call Muslims as Herzegovinians, or to call Croats as Bosnians. Serbs are just (R srpska) Serbs. Serbs identify themselves with Republic Srpska (autonomous part of B-H), not with Bosnia and Herzegovina.

This is exactly the same case as with ex-Czechoslovakia. It was wrong to refer to Slovakian clubs as (only) Czech, and Czech clubs as (only) Slovakian. In Czechoslovakia either Czech clubs were Czech and Slovakian clubs were Slovakian, or all clubs had to be Czecho-Slovakian. Using one term for both was wrong, very wrong. These are identical cases.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 17-07-2013, 23:13 Edited by: shisraelit at: 17-07-2013, 23:15	neftchi-skenderbeu 0-0. Not a good result for neftchi,now they can t lose in albania but a draw with goal is enough. Last year skenderbeu dominated at home against debrecen,for neftchi it will be tough.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 17-07-2013, 23:25	I`ve seen Skenderbeu-Debrecen last year and Debrecen was lucky to come away with a 1:0 loss, but in the 2nd leg the Albanians showed very little and lost timidly. Yes, Neftchi must score and we`ll see, anything could happen, very open.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 17-07-2013, 23:51	1-3. England, Germany, Spain 1.714 4-5. Azerbaijan, Iceland 1.375 (that`s right, 4 wins and 3 draws for both countries, without a single loss!) 6-8. France, Italy, Portugal 1.333 9. Kazakhstan 1.125 .... Well, have a good look, because in the next 50 years you might not get again a chance! And after tomorrow`s games...it might look even better.

Author: dzomba
Date: 18-07-2013, 15:48

Don't overestimate beating crappy opponents. Azerbaijan is still just a level of Finland and Georgia, not any better, and Kazakhstan is still level of Bosnia and Lithuania.
It's true they improved, especially Azerbaijan, over the last 4-5 years, but still beating round 1 opposition is just their job, something they are supposed to do, nothing more. They are still far from making it to EL GS, what Finland, Slovenia, Georgia, Moldova, Lithuania did already.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 18-07-2013, 16:55 Edited by: bugylibicska at: 18-07-2013, 16:56	``They are still far from making it to EL GS, what Finland, Slovenia, Georgia, Moldova, Lithuania did already.`` How far, last season Neftchi Baki already broke the ice! They`ve made it to the EL groupstage, with Inter, Rubin and Partizan in the same group.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 18-07-2013, 23:30	Azerbaijan have made it into the top 30 with 30th. If they get 0.500 more points, they'll have 10.000.

Author: shisraelit
Date: 18-07-2013, 23:38

irtish pavlodar win at home 3-2,the tie is very open,aktobe lost at hodd 1-0,bad surprise for me,but they can still qualify.

For azerbaijian khazar lost 2-0 in israel,nothing to say,maccabi is better,inter baku lost 2-0 at tromso and now it s very difficult,qarabag win 2-1 at home against piast,the tie is very open.

For kazakhstan both irtish and aktobe can qualify,instead for azaerbaijian only qarabag for me can pass this round.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 19-07-2013, 03:07

``irtish pavlodar win at home 3-2,the tie is very open,aktobe lost at hodd 1-0,bad surprise for me,but they can still qualify.

For azerbaijian khazar lost 2-0 in israel,nothing to say,maccabi is better,inter baku lost 2-0 at tromso and now it s very difficult,qarabag win 2-1 at home against piast,the tie is very open.

For kazakhstan both irtish and aktobe can qualify,instead for azaerbaijian only qarabag for me can pass this round.``

It seems we agree here! I`ve high hopes for both Kazakh teams and Qarabag. Khazar and Inter Baki almost out. Maccabi Haifa are too strong, I`d accept a draw now, but Inter have a fighting chance.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 19-07-2013, 04:29	1-3. England, Germany, Spain 1.714 4. Azerbaijan 1.625 5. Iceland 1.500 6. Kazakhstan 1.375 ....

Author: dzomba
Date: 19-07-2013, 08:12
Edited by: dzomba
at: 19-07-2013, 08:12

``They are still far from making it to EL GS, what Finland, Slovenia, Georgia, Moldova, Lithuania did already.``
How far, last season Neftchi Baki already broke the ice! They`ve made it to the EL groupstage, with Inter, Rubin and Partizan in the same group.

Oh, yeah. Sorry i forgot. But that's still just matching what other mentioned countries just did earlier, not surpassing them.
Several years ago Belarus was among those countries, but then they (or better to say BATE only) made a break. Such break is still not likely for Azerbaijan, despite tendency of rising.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 19-07-2013, 13:45

``Don't overestimate beating crappy opponents. Azerbaijan is still just a level of Finland and Georgia, not any better, and Kazakhstan is still level of Bosnia and Lithuania.``
I know, they`re no match for a serious team. I don`t think I overestimate them, but maybe my enthusiasm carries me away sometimes and it could be perceived as such. Actually, I think they`re the underdogs in almost every game, so any win, no matter how small, is welcome.

Author: shisraelit
Date: 24-07-2013, 00:05
Edited by: shisraelit
at: 24-07-2013, 14:07

And shaktar karaganda eliminate bate,great,however what a funny goal!!!At the end players and fans celebrated a lot!!! But no derby with azerbaijian because skenderbeu eliminate neftchi. At least a new country in the gs,i hope kazakhistan. if karaganda will beat skenderbeu,we will see at the gs 3 matches start very early,at least 16.00 or early,usually in november in kazakhstan it s very cold.

Thursday it will be a battle among iceland,azerbaijian and kazakhstan for keep the first place of the country ranking 2013- 2014 at least one week!!!

Edit:Hmmm,probably romania,sweden or norway will end this week first,however i just see that bert didn t give any point for azerbaijian,probably i m wrong but in the regular time skenderbeu-neftchi end 0-0,i believe for the coefficent extra time doesn t count.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 24-07-2013, 05:17	Yes, extra time doesn't count, it goes down as a victory for Skenderbeu and Albania. Thus Iceland assume sole leadership of Europe ahead of England, Germany and Spain. Take a look people, it's a fun sight to behold: https://kassiesa.home.xs4all.nl/bert/uefa/data/method4/ccoef2014.html

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 24-07-2013, 07:24 Edited by: bugylibicska at: 24-07-2013, 07:37	1. Iceland 1.750 2-4. England, Germany, Spain 1.714 5-6. Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan 1.625 For Kazakhstan 1.625 was their record in the last 5 years, so it`s almost sure they`ll break it. (big time) And of course, Iceland already broke their record! Azerbaijan have some way to go, their record is 3.000. --------

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: mspm89 Date: 24-07-2013, 08:23 Edited by: mspm89 at: 24-07-2013, 08:25	What a serendipitous outcome. Either Albania or Kazakhstan are assured of GS football. Good for both nations. I root for Kazakhstan too in this one.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 24-07-2013, 23:10	i read on uefa.com that the 2 matches between shaktar karaganda and skenderbeu korce will be played in astana and tirana instead karaganda and korce. It s very sad for the fans that can t move to other cities for follow their teams in the 2 matches maybe the most important of their poor history.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 24-07-2013, 23:50	Well the winner gets group stage football. It must surely be for both the most important match in their history.

Author: AnelZ
Date: 25-07-2013, 04:35

There are rumors that if Skenderbeu qualifies for groups stage European football that they might need to play outside of Albania. I know that UEFA has the same requirements for play-off of CL as for group stage for CL and EL. The same thing was said for Bosnia and Herzegovina last year, but then UEFA allowed for group stage of European football to be played on Koševo stadium or Banja Luka city stadium if a club qualifies for it. The same story that our clubs will need to play group stage football outside of the Bosnia and Herzegovina emerged when Željezničar had the chance to pass Viktoria Plzen and UEFA still hasn't answered if any stadium will satisfy their standards for group stage of CL and EL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 25-07-2013, 05:31	When Debrecen made the group-stage UEFA forced them to play in Budapest. Tomorrow, they`ll play their game vs. Stromsgodset in Nyiregyhaza, a city not far away.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 25-07-2013, 05:40

Big day for Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan, 5 of their teams are involved.
Aktobe play Hodd at home (0:1), Irtysh play in Bosnia vs. Siroki Brijeg (3:2). Both Khazar Lankaran and Inter Baki have a two goal disadvantage vs. Maccabi Haifa (0:2) and Tromso (0:2)respectively, with little chance for turning the ties around, both play at home. Qarabag travel to Poland to face Piast Gliwice with only a slim advantage (2:1).

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 25-07-2013, 08:56	When there is no stadium in a country that meets the GS-criteria UEFA always makes an exception. Since they don't want teams to play CL/EL matches outside their own country. And every country has a stadium that is good enough for national team matches, so then it should not be a problem also to stage CL-GS and EL-GS matches in that stadium.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 26-07-2013, 01:23

I`m quite satisfied, because it could have turned out worse. Aktobe progressed with a 2:0 win, but Irtysh were dumped out, losing 2:0.
Kazakhstan have now a record of 1.875 points and two teams are still standing. Aktobe play Breidablik and Shakhter Karagandy play Skenderbeu Korce in the CL, so surely there`re some more points to come.
Qarabag advanced after overtime and play Gefle. Inter Baki won 1:0, came close to make up their 2:0 loss in the 1st leg, but it wasn`t to be. Khazar Lankaran were humiliated by Maccabi Haifa, 8:0 is just not acceptable. Azerbaijan has now 2.000 points, but only Qarabag carry the flag alone.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 26-07-2013, 02:07	1. Romania 2.250 2. Iceland 2.125 3. Sweden 2.100 4. Azerbaijan 2.000 5. Kazakhstan 1.875 6. Norway 1.800 7. Moldova 1.750 8-10. England, Germany, Spain 1.714 ------------ Hungary and Finland have no teams left! Real brothers even in trouble!

Author: shisraelit
Date: 26-07-2013, 18:52

Now both kazakhstan team have good chances to advance in the play-off round of cl and el,in the ranking they should passes finland(what a poor season)! and bosnia herzegovina. For azerbaijian i hope qarabag will advance in play-off round aginst gefle,totally shame for khazar(for me MATCH FIXED,LIKE HONVED-CELIK,DACIA-TEUTA AND ELFSBORG-DAUGAVA),inter baku win but tromso advance. in cl big opportunity miss by neftchi.

OFF TOPIC:in the ranking i see ireland has finished the season behind san marino and andorra!!! what a shame,only 2 years after shamrock rovers qualified for elgs...

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 27-07-2013, 00:45

Well, I`ve seen the first 6 goals and it seemed like every time the ball broke, went to an Israeli player, even when surrounded by 3-4 Azeris. Very lucky goals, but of course 8 are just too many and suspicious.
The Daugavpils-Elfsborg game seemed somewhat different, very elementary mistakes in defence by the Latvians, I`d be more inclined to believe fixing here.
I primarily support Aktobe from Kazakhstan and Qarabag from Azerbaijan. If they advance, and I believe they both have a reasonably decent chance, they might be seeded in the 3rd round of EL next season, albeit Aktobe look like future champions, so they`ll avoid EL, but the points might come handily in the CL as well.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 27-07-2013, 02:16 Edited by: Lorric at: 27-07-2013, 02:17	@ shisraelit Wow, you're right, Ireland's coefficient has been obliterated. They've traded in a 2.500 for a 0.250. It should be the worst haul of the season, only Austria is behind at 0.100 with the elimination of Sturm, which will surely change with 4 more teams to enter the fray. Dropped from 36th to 41st in the table, with potential to drop further.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 30-07-2013, 17:02	The dream is almost reality,shakter defeated skenderbeu 3-0,now they are almost in gs!!! They must defend this result in albania!!! Thursday we will see aktobe against breidablik from iceland,what a trip! p.s. shakter conceded no goal in 270 minutes of his champions league games!

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 01-08-2013, 02:11	1. Romania 2.500 2-3. Iceland, Kazakhstan 2.125 4. Sweden 2.100 5. Azerbaijan 2.000 6. Norway 1.900 7. Croatia 1.875 8. Moldova 1.750 9-11. England, Germany, Spain 1.714 ------------ And tomorrow Aktobe-Breidablik!

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 02-08-2013, 00:23	1. Romania 3.000 2. Kazakhstan 2.375 3. Azerbaijan 2.250 4-5. Iceland, Croatia 2.125 6-7. Norway, Sweden 2.100 8-10. Poland, England,Spain 1.857 ------------------------- It cannot get much better!

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 06-08-2013, 01:37

Chornomorets Odessa - Crvena Zvezda 3:1, 28,862
Hajduk Split - Dila Gori 0:1, 28,000
Sevilla - Mladost Podgorica 3:0, 27,548
St. Etienne - Milsami Orhei 3:0, 24,671
Qarabag - Gefle 1:0, 22,000
Slask Wroclaw - Club Brugge 1:0, 17,132
Swansea - Malmo 4:0, 16,176
Aktobe - Breidablik 1:0, 12,200
Petrolul Ploesti - Vitesse Arnhem 1:1, 11,827
Botev Plovdiv - Stuttgart 1:1, 10,000

Most visited games in the 3rd round 1st leg of the EL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 06-08-2013, 03:44	Celtic - Elfsborg 1:0, 38,546 PSV - Zulte Waregem 2:0, 35,000 Salzburg - Fenerbahce 1:1, 28,640 Lyon - Grasshopper 1:0, 27,331 Shakhter Karagandy - Skenderbeu Korce 3:0, 21,800 Dinamo Tbilisi - Steaua Bucuresti 0:2, 20,728 APOEL Nicosia - Maribor 1:1, 17,387 Basel - Maccabi Tel-Aviv 1:0, 12,353 Dinamo Zagreb - Sheriff Tiraspol 1:0, 10,347 Most visited games in the 3rd round 1st leg of the CL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: mspm89 Date: 06-08-2013, 23:00	So, Shakhter is almost there. At least ELGS, but they could get a bit lucky in the draw and avoid Basel, Steaua, Celtic and Plzen. The other possible seeds (Legia, Dinamo, Austria) don't seem extremely scary. BTW, i hear that in this 2nd leg there was also suspicion of match-fixing, is there someone on the forum who has some insight?

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 07-08-2013, 02:00	There's a big thread on the Betfair forum saying the match was rigged: http://community.betfair.com/football/go/thread/view/94070/30032101/skenderbeu- v-shakhter-karagandy--look?pg=1

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 07-08-2013, 04:22
Edited by: bugylibicska
at: 07-08-2013, 05:00

``absolutely impossible to bet in such games, they are almost changing the game of play depending on what the punters are betting, doing the opposite Laugh``

I`ve read these ``punters``, well most of them are not very sharp. The guy I`ve quoted has good common sense. William Hill gave odds of 4.60 3.60 1.60 the day before the game. Today morning the 4.60 went down to 2.40 before the game and then taken off. I wouldn`t touch it, looked fishy.

Author: mspm89
Date: 08-08-2013, 05:33

What under-the-table process must be carried out to do this kind of folly? I understand there was suspicion on Skenderbeu conceding goals on purpose in he 1st leg so the game ended Over 2.5, or something like this. Then in the 2nd leg, it's Shakhter who is willing to throw the game and risk elimination if they let them too close (only to make the very convenient 3-0 to 3-2 transition).

It's one thing if Albanian league is pestered with match fixing within their own country, but European matches should be out of reach for the mobs. I supported Shakhter's cause, but i have to say Uefa should investigate all this. Even though this kind of fishy behavior tends to compensate itself. They're going to get smacked in every match until whatever GS they're in, or next year some Faroese team will do them in the 1st round.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 08-08-2013, 06:04

Well, I`m betting sometimes, but not regularly. I don`t really understand how the mobs manipulate these games, I admit, but I`m not really interested in the details. If the game was fixed and UEFA are able to prove it, both teams should be thrown out. I support the Kazakhs, but fair play is much more paramount. No exception. My understanding that around 70K Euros were gambled, not a big money, but maybe big for them. Sometimes only a few players are involved, not the whole team. We`ll see.

Author: shisraelit
Date: 09-08-2013, 00:50
Edited by: shisraelit
at: 09-08-2013, 01:00

After a marathon in the cold iceland(rain and only 11°c) aktobe beat breidablik on penalties and goes in play-off round. For tomorrow i hope for besiktas,salzburg,paok(obviously reasons)...if not i hope in sheriff,nordsjaelland,estoril and chernomorets odessa. Same for qarabag. What an evening/night of football!!! I love el qualifications!

edit:congrats also to qarabag,they won away in sweden against gefle.

Author: mspm89
Date: 09-08-2013, 01:27
Edited by: mspm89
at: 09-08-2013, 01:31

The only caveat in Kazakh campaign (if any) is that in order to move up a little more in the ranking (and break into the top 32), they'd need awful performances from Sheriff and especially Maribor (this last one assured of GS and all). Before any future amendment in the access list is made though, being at 34th place is enough for a direct place in ELQ2 when CLTH is qualified by league.

Of course, this discussion is only valid if Aktobe and Shakhter score a few more points. The possibility of both not getting any in the matches ahead is still high, to be honest.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 09-08-2013, 07:05
Edited by: bugylibicska
at: 09-08-2013, 07:07

1. Romania 3.750
2-4. Azerbaijan, Iceland, Croatia 2.500
5-7. Czech Rep., Poland, Kazakhstan 2.375
----------------------------------------
East-North 8:0

CL: 2:0
Nordsjaelland - Zenit 0:1, 0:5 -- 0:6
Molde - Legia 1:1, 0:0 -- 1:1 Legia by the away goal

EL: 6:0
Motherwell - Kuban Krasnodar 0:2, 0:1 -- 0:3
Jablonec - Stromsgodset 2:1, 3:1 -- 5:2
Randers - Rubin Kazan 1:2, 0:2 -- 1:4
Qarabag - Gefle 1:0, 2:0 -- 3:0
Minsk - St.Johnstone 0:1, 1:0 -- 1:1 Minsk after pen.
Aktobe - Breidablik 1:0, 0:1 -- 1:1 Aktobe after pen.

Author: mspm89
Date: 09-08-2013, 14:28
Edited by: mspm89
at: 09-08-2013, 14:31

It's hard to think of Shakhter advancing in this round, but if there's a hope, Celtic performs very erratically from year to year. Complacency stemming from the absence of Rangers in their league doesn't help either. I even see more hope for them than for Aktobe. I can't recall Dinamo Kiev not making at least ELGS. Same for Qarabag; even if Eintracht's strength decreases relative to last season, German standards mean they should reach GS, minimum. Teams like Aachen (in 2.Bundesliga that year) and Hertha (relegated later in the season) made the last 32, for crying out loud.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 09-08-2013, 15:05

It would be unrealistic to expect any one of them to advance. Shakhter Karagandy got the dream draw I was hoping for. Celtic were the biggest name in the hat, I think all the tickets will be sold out in a matter of hours. To reach this stage and going out vs. Dinamo Zagreb or Plzen would be like an anticlimax. And they`ll be playing GS in the EL afterwards.
Aktobe I wanted to get paired with Swansea, but Dynamo Kyiv will be a crowd pleaser, too. Practically, Aktobe`s chances to advance vs. any team from this group were minimal, so again it`s better to go out vs. Dynamo than vs. Genk or Alkmaar.
Qarabag might had a chance if paired with Salzburg or Nordsjaelland, but less than 50% in my opinion. I wished Sevilla for them, but Eintracht Frankfurt, being a German team, surely will fill the stadium.
I`m happy for the Georgians. Dila Gori had no big name in their group and they`ve got paired with Rapid Vienna, probably the weakest. They might fancy their chances, though Rapid are still favourites.
Dinamo Tbilisi might had a chance for advancing if paired with Estoril or Partizan, but hey they got another dream draw, Tottenham. Tbilisi will be rocking on their matchday!

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 14-08-2013, 17:28

Metalist Kharkiv - PAOK Saloniki 1:1, 39,286
Steaua Bucuresti - Dinamo Tbilisi 1:1, 37,249
Fenerbahce - Salzburg 3:1, 32,669
Legia Warszawa - Molde 0:0, 23,379
Partizan Beograd - Ludogorets 0:1, 22,312
Zenit - Nordsjaelland 5:0, 20,072
Maccabi Tel-Aviv - Basel 3:3, 13,100
Maribor - APOEL Nicosia 0:0, 12,100
Sheriff Tiraspol - Dinamo Zagreb 0:3, 10,234

Most visited games in the 2nd leg of 3rd round in the CL.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 14-08-2013, 17:40

Crvena Zvezda - Chornomorets Odessa 0:0, 39,730
Kuban Krasnodar - Motherwell 1:0, 31,754
Club Brugge - Slask Wroclaw 3:3, 25,945
Standard Liege - Xanthi Skoda 2:1, 24,706
Trabzonspor - Dinamo Minsk 0:0, 22,803
Bursaspor - Vojvodina 0:3, 19,130
Lech Poznan - Zalgiris Vilnius 2:1, 16,326
Rapid Wien - Asteras Tripolis 3:1, 15,300
Dila Gori - Hajduk Split 1:0, 13,891
Malmo - Swansea 0:0, 11,538
Maccabi Haifa - Ventspils 3:0, 10,800
Vitesse Arnhem - Petrolul Ploiesti 1:2, 10,088

Most visited games in the 2nd leg of the 3rd round of EL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: shisraelit Date: 21-08-2013, 22:02 Edited by: shisraelit at: 21-08-2013, 22:03	What a fantastic win for shakter karaganda yesterday. At least the sheep isn t dead invane! But i think celtic can reverse in the second leg,but if shakter score an away goal... Tomorrow aktobe against dinamo kiev is the underdog, i hope for another miracle!!! I have a question:why the match is at 15.00(18.00 in aktobe)? Usually aktobe play at home at 21.00 local time.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 22-08-2013, 02:10 Edited by: bugylibicska at: 22-08-2013, 16:58	Schalke - PAOK 1:1, 52,444 Steaua - Legia 1:1, 50,655 Fenerbahce - Arsenal 0:3, 40,375 Lyon - Real Sociedad 0:2, 35,000 PSV - Milan 1:1, 35,000 Dinamo Zagreb - Austria Wien 0:2, 21,729 Shakhter Karagandy - Celtic 2:0, 20,000 Ludogorets - Basel 2:4, 11,927 Plzen - Maribor 3:1, 11,158 The most visited games in the 1st leg of playoff in the CL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Lorric Date: 22-08-2013, 13:35 Edited by: Lorric at: 22-08-2013, 13:37	Missing PSV with 35,000. Pacos only have a capacity of 5,255.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 22-08-2013, 14:10	Soccerway still shows 5,000 for PSV - Milan, pretty sure that`s the wrong number. Where have you seen 35,000. Pacos de Ferreira played in Porto`s stadium (Dragao).

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 22-08-2013, 15:16 Edited by: Forza-AZ at: 22-08-2013, 15:17	@bugylibicska I watched PSV-Milan on TV. The stadium was (almost) full, so near 35.000 people. @Lorric Paços played their match in the stadium of FC Porto, so much more could have attented. However the "home" fans had to travel quit a bit, so it is logical there weren't that many people there.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 22-08-2013, 17:00	I`ve found it strange that only 5 thousand showed up vs. Milan, when usually 30 thousand the norm for them even in the domestic championship. I`ve edited my post, thanks for correction.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 23-08-2013, 03:11

1. Romania 3.875
2. Czech Republic 2.875
3. Croatia 2.750
4. Kazakhstan 2.625
5. Russia 2.583
6-9. Azerbaijan, Iceland, Poland, Serbia 2.500
-----------------------------------------------
Well, all the teams from Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan and Georgia lost, but Shakhter Karagandy! I was hoping for maybe a draw here and there, but realistically all teams overachieved already. What Shakhter Karagandy did so far is nothing less than historical. If they`ll somehow survive the 2nd leg, the expected Glasgow onslaught, it`ll be big time celebration, but even the EL groupstage will be a huge milestone for the country. I`m secretly hoping Dila Gori might make the EL groupstage, too.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 24-08-2013, 03:06

Chornomorets Odessa - Skenderbeu Korce 1:0, 34,000
Kuban Krasnodar - Feyenoord 1:0, 32,275
Qarabag - Eintracht Frankfurt 0:2, 30,500
Dinamo Tbilisi - Tottenham 0:5, 22,500
St.Gallen - Spartak Moskva 1:1, 18,000
Sevilla - Slask Wroclaw 4:1, 16,758
Partizan Beograd - Thun 1:0, 15,000
Grasshopper - Fiorentina 1:2, 15,000
Rapid Wien - Dila Gori 1:0, 14,500
Swansea - Petrolul Ploiesti 5:1, 12,590
Aktobe - Dynamo Kyiv 2:3, 12,500
Maccabi Haifa - Astra Giurgiu 2:0, 11,900
Pandurii - Braga 0:1, 11,500
Esbjerg - St.Etienne 4:3, 11,478
Vojvodina - Sheriff Tiraspol 1:1, 11,000
Kukesi - Trabzonspor 0:2, 10,000
Rijeka - Stuttgart 2:1, 10,000
Udinese - Liberec 1:3, 10,000

The most visited games in the 1st leg of playoff round in the EL.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: executor Date: 24-08-2013, 08:58	Pandurii - Braga 0:1, 11,500 Where did you take that number from? I saw the game and I can tell you it's grossly inflated. Our media reports 6,000 people and even this seems too high. Remember that the game was played in Cluj-Napoca, some 200 km away and the interest was low. I would've estimated the attendance at 3-4,000 people.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: SirHenri Date: 24-08-2013, 11:25	Te crowd in Qarabag was great, so really fun to watch that game (beside the win ). The re-match is nearly sold out already, so 45.000 fans are expected to visit first Eintracht homematch for 7 years.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 24-08-2013, 16:46	Well, I usually rely on Soccerway, not the most reliable source, I know. Interesting, 45 thousand in Frankfurt when the tie is already decided and less than 10 thousand in Stuttgart vs. Botev Plovdiv when the tie was open after 1:1 in Bulgaria.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 24-08-2013, 17:12	@bugylibicska Stuttgart-Botev was played in Großaspach (40 km from Stuttgart) and the stadium only has a capacity of 10.000

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 24-08-2013, 23:25	Right. That escaped my attention! Thanks.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: paul7 Date: 25-08-2013, 19:57	sorry,need help Champions League Europa League Q1 0.50 0.25 Q2 1.00 0.50 Q3 - 1.00 Q4 - 1.50 group stage - 2.00 (minimum) about bonus points. ,if Shakhtar qualifies for champions league groups they will get 0 bonus points,if Shakhtar looses to Celtic they go to europa league group stage and a awarded with 2 bonus points.i get confused ??!!!!

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: ransborg Date: 25-08-2013, 21:48	For CL GS the team gets 4 qualification points. For EL GS the team is secured at least 2 points, but this is not added on top of the points the club makes for the matches. As such it is also highly attractive to qualify to the CL GS with regard to points (although there can be cases, e.g. if the team gets seeded 4 in CL but 2 in EL where it almost balances out).

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 25-08-2013, 23:03	@paul7 The 4 points for CL-GS are not in the list you mention, because they are not only for the clubcoefficient, but also for the countrycoefficient. They are the same kind of bonuspoints you get for qualifying for CL-1/8 (5) and CL/EL QF (1), SF (1) and final (1).

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 29-08-2013, 01:27	Arsenal - Fenerbahce 2:0, 56,271 Milan - PSV 3:0, 51,598 Celtic Shakhter Karagandy 3:0, 50,063 Real Sociedad - Lyon 2:0, 28,955 Legia Warszawa - Steaua Bucuresti 2:2, 21,514 Zenit - Pacos Ferreira 4:2, 21,507 Basel - Ludogorets 2:0, 15,733 Maribor - Plzen 0:1, 12,306 Austria Wien - Dinamo Zagreb 2:3, 10,500 Most visited games in the 2nd leg of playoff round in the CL.

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 02-09-2013, 16:11

So, Shakhter missed their chance to play CL GS, lost 3:0 vs. Celtic.
Too bad, but that`s reality. I hope sooner or later they`ll get another chance, if not them, then another Kazakh team. Now they`ll play EL GS and my hope that they`ll get a glamour tie didn`t materialize. On the other hand they have a chance to collect some points for Kazakhstan. PAOK, Maccabi Haifa, Alkmaar in their group.
Good luck!

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 02-09-2013, 16:29

Besiktas - Tromso 2:0, 55,000
Eintracht Frankfurt - Qarabag 2:1, 52,000
Feyenoord - Kuban Krasnodar 1:2, 45,000
Slask Wroclaw - Sevilla 0:5, 42,000
Tottenham - Dinamo Tbilisi 3:0, 35,000
Fiorentina - Grasshopper 0:1, 35,000
Betis - Jablonec 6:0, 27,351
Dila Gori - Rapid Wien 0:3, 25,000
St.Etienne - Esbjerg 0:1, 24,321
Trabzonspor - Kukesi 3:1, 23,500
Standard Liege - Minsk 3:1, 22,000
Skenderbeu Korce - Chornomorets Odessa 1:0, 19,000
Nice - Apollon Limassol 1:0, 18,000
Stuttgart - Rijeka 2:2, 16,000
Petrolul Ploiesti Swansea 2:1, 15,000
Spartak Moskva - St.Gallen 2:4, 14,000
Genk - Hafnarfjordur 5:2, 13,000
Dnipro - Kalju Nomme 2:0, 12,831
Alkmaar - Atromitos 0:2, 11,569
Liberec - Udinese 1:1, 9,700

Most visited games in the 2nd leg of playoff round in the EL.
(Dynamo Kyiv - Aktobe and APOEL - Zulte Waregem data missing.)

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: JPV Date: 04-09-2013, 08:56	according to Belgian newspapers, 19000 in Apoel-Zulte Waregem

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: AnelZ Date: 04-09-2013, 19:40	It would be great to see the top 10 most visited matches through whole EL qualification and 10 most visited matches through whole CL qualifications and in which round it was (QR1, QR2, QR3 or PO).

Author: bugylibicska
Date: 05-09-2013, 05:39

Yeah, I`ve found the missing games:
APOEL - Zulte 1:2, 18,959
Dynamo Kyiv - Aktobe 70 the Ukrainian site has 0, so I think this was a game with closed out spectators for some reason.
The first two rounds data disappeared when Bert decided he`s seen enough in the North vs. East thread, but I don`t think those numbers could compete for the best ten records. Small teams, small stadiums, rarely over 20 thousands.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: nemesys Date: 05-09-2013, 11:39	The first two rounds data disappeared when Bert decided he`s seen enough in the North vs. East thread Did you check the archive? From my experience, in the cool democratic anarchy which this forum is, it is really unlikely that something gets censored. Cheers! - nemesys

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 05-09-2013, 12:01	Topics are automatically moved to the archive when they are open for a certain amount of time. It doesn't matter if people still post in them. So all info should still be found in the archive.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 05-09-2013, 17:57	Yes, I`ve checked the archive and couldn`t find it. It was North vs. East or something like that. The only thing I can imagine, Bert was bribed into the North group by some geography expert and decided to censor my pro East stand! Of course I`m joking, but all jokes are serious!

Author: nemesys
Date: 05-09-2013, 20:13
Edited by: nemesys
at: 05-09-2013, 20:31

The only thing I can imagine, Bert was bribed into the North group by some geography expert and decided to censor my pro East stand!

// start joke-sarcastic mode

Yes, he was payed by Platini to do so. And tomorrow Men in Black* will knock your door to give you a "friendly" advice about this issue.

*Edit - I mean the UEFA Men in Black: Ovebro, and the others northern referee, they'll wistle you offside and show you a red card.

// end joke-sarcastic mode

Cheers!

- nemesys

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: Ricardo Date: 06-09-2013, 16:35	@buglybicka, what are you looking for. what kind of information was in the post? It was not the topic 'Armenia' or 'EL-Q1 subgroups'? if you give a little info we can search for the info and so maybe find back the topic?

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 06-09-2013, 18:14	The name of the thread was like North vs. East or something like that about the regional groupings in the cups.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: nemesys Date: 06-09-2013, 18:32 Edited by: nemesys at: 06-09-2013, 18:38	@bugylibicska Any of those? Link Link Link Link Just trying to help. Cheers! - nemesys

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: bugylibicska Date: 07-09-2013, 02:01	No, but thanks. I know and appreciate it, but not important. When I woke up one morning it was gone.

Re: azerbaijan and kazakhstan
Author: nemesys Date: 07-09-2013, 18:58 Edited by: nemesys at: 07-09-2013, 18:59	@bugylibicska No, but thanks. I know and appreciate it, but not important. Ok, as you say. - nemesys