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Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 28-09-2012, 15:03	Hello i am new at this forum. i have followed it for a while and i decided to get an account. This topic is for Malko and the people who would like to defend Bundesliga (in my opinion the number 3 league in Europe) against the french league (in my opinion the number 4 league because of the decline of serie a)

Re: Germany vs France
Author: reisanibal Date: 28-09-2012, 15:36	There is no Germany vs France rivalry. WTF? There is a relevant topic for your France vs. kind of discussion and the opponent is Portugal, not even Italy yet. Follow that. The last thing this forum needs is another troll like Malko.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 28-09-2012, 16:19 Edited by: Rienk at: 28-09-2012, 16:20	This isnt about the coeffiecient ranking it is about malko vs almost everyone about germany vs france. Malko thinks Ligue 1 is better which is his opinion, i think the Bundesliga is better like almost everyone. but on the other hand i also think French football is on the rise because of PSG and the decline of the Serie a.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Cirdan Date: 29-09-2012, 17:56	@Rienk: Malko doesn't actually think Ligue 1 is better. He just likes to rile people up, preferably Germans. My advice is to simply ignore him.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 29-09-2012, 19:55	I actually think he does.

Author: Malko
Date: 30-09-2012, 18:53

Rienk, you are right. Ligue 1 is in average better than Bundesliga.
The top-clubs of Bundesliga have got better results the last years (even if direct confrontation is some equal),but there are some reasons.
One of them is that french teams did not take EL as serious as Bundesliga, but concentrated on the own championship. Much often because they were in danger to get to Ligue 2. and the reason therefore is that in average, the Ligue 1 is much more difficult than the Bundesliga. In the Bundesliga, a fairy good team is assured to stay in the league, inFrance, everybody risks to go down.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 30-09-2012, 21:56	I didnt say i agreed with you about ligue 1. I think bundesliga is better bayern is the 3rd best team in europe after barca and madrid and also dortmund can compete with the likes of juve, chelsea and arsenal.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Malko Date: 01-10-2012, 13:43	I didn't mean you agree with me on this point, but that you are right my opinion is that Ligue 1 is better than Bundesliga. Concerning Bayern, i think Paris Sg is presently better amnd Marseille is equal. But Paris has to prove it. Dortmund cannot compete with Marseille (2 defeats last year).

Author: Rienk
Date: 01-10-2012, 17:04

PSG is probably better than any italian team except for juve who might b equal to PSG but Bayern is better for sure they have made it to two CL finals in the last 3 years. You also say Dortmund is worse than Marseille but that is last year and that year Bayern was much better than marseille in the CL but Dortmund finished above Bayern.

Also almost every German international plays in the bundesliga but half of the French internationals play abroad. the German team is much better than the French team internationally so that means in my eyes than BL is better tan ligue 1.

Author: Malko
Date: 02-10-2012, 18:52

I am not sure that at this moment the german national team is better than the french.......if i see the last few games.

Why do less german players play abroad' ask maybe why English teams prefer players from Ligue 1 than from Bundesliga.......not only arsene Wenger.

Bundesliga has 4 or 5 correct good teams,....but many Bundesliga-teams do not have the shape to play in Ligue 1 in France. Fortunately they do not have to......

btw, how would Paris have made the same european score the last years than bayern, if the team is even not 1 year old......?

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 03-10-2012, 14:15	Arsene Wenger bought a player from Koln wich relegated to the 2. Bundeliga but the french players Arsene buys are from Marseille (nasri for example) a top team in ligue 1. Arsenal can buy players from top teams in the ligue 1 but not from top teams in the Bundesliga.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: greenbay Date: 03-10-2012, 17:36 Edited by: greenbay at: 03-10-2012, 17:42	It's obvious: - The French NT is lousy since 2008. - The German Mannschaft on the other hand went to all semi-finals since then. - No French team wanted to sign Ribéry in 2008. - Bayern did. So due to logics: => Ligue 1 must be better than Bundesliga, if such lousy NT player like Ribéry can only get a contract in Bundesliga, but not in Ligue 1. Any questions?

Author: Malko
Date: 03-10-2012, 22:34
Edited by: Malko
at: 03-10-2012, 22:36

????' German National team was as lousy as the french in last Euro. They had Denmark, therefor got to semi-final. vs Spain (like France), they would have been out too.......

Ribery? LOL...he should not be in French National team, he is not one of the best

Rienk, the big clubs do not want Bundesliga players, they want Ligue1 players, cause they know, there they are closer to what they are asked for in England. Fast matches EVERY week !

Author: scapulaire24
Date: 03-10-2012, 23:25

@ greenbay
"- No French team wanted to sign Ribéry in 2008."

Ribery sign with Bayern in 2007.
He sign fot Bayern, not because no french team wants him but because no french team CAN'T sign him.

Lyon offers 22 mio €, Bayern 30 mio €.
Bayern money = Lyon + Marseille + Lille + another team.

Everybody screams "overpaid" whem PSG paid 30 or 40 for guys like Thiago Silva or Pastore but stay quiet when Bayern pay 40 for Martinez.
Did you see him against BATE ?

Re: Germany vs France
Author: schlumpy Date: 04-10-2012, 07:30	So you guys created a thread just because of the mighty PSG that once again fell down against Porto? C'mon, be serious, the French league might be a good domestic league, but no teams can actually make a difference in Euro Competitions. Anyway, many players dont choose to play in France if there is another option, so its not surprising

Re: Germany vs France
Author: schlumpy Date: 04-10-2012, 07:33	@malko You're not sure if the German National team is better than the French at the moment?????????? Germany was in the semi-finals in the World Cup and the Euro Champ, where was France??? And trust me in its national team, Portugal, Netherlands, Italy and others are definately better than the french team

Re: Germany vs France
Author: schlumpy Date: 04-10-2012, 07:35	@malko ????' German National team was as lousy as the french in last Euro. They had Denmark, therefor got to semi-final. vs Spain (like France), they would have been out too....... Are you on drugs? If france would be in the group of portugal netherlands and germany they would have 0 points

Author: UploaderAfonso
Date: 06-10-2012, 13:23
Edited by: UploaderAfonso
at: 06-10-2012, 13:28

It's funny that Malko shut up after the game between FC Porto and PSG and didn't answer you! Lol, PSG was much stronger and would win the game easily, but then, because of fear (I think), he said that the probabilities of winning in FC Porto's stadium were now 50%! That's what the game showed us! I bet he will say that he doesn't mind it because now France is in front of Portugal! LOL. So predictable! He is always changing the subject!

Author: Malko
Date: 06-10-2012, 16:00
Edited by: Malko
at: 06-10-2012, 16:49

Uploader Afonso, Porto won 1-0, that's not much, even it's a win. With a little more luck, Ibra would have shot the goal of the century....and bet? PSG go further than Porto in this CL

schlumpy. If germany would have Spain in the quarterfinals, they would not have gone to the semifinals too. The group? Was not so difficult as said. netherlands was a 0-team in it. I would have liked to see Germany in a group with England, Sweden and Ukraine. Not sure they get out!

Concerning direct confrontation, presently this year, one game. and a draw that the 13th of Ligue1 got at the third of Bundesliaga.
let's count this way :

This makes presently: (13-3)/2 = +5 points for France.

next issues will be Moenchengladbach-Marseille and Bayern-Lille.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: UploaderAfonso Date: 06-10-2012, 16:07 Edited by: UploaderAfonso at: 06-10-2012, 16:30	Lol, Porto absolutely dominated PSG! It deserved to score more goals! Did you even see the game? Ok, we will see (I didn't even talk about bets and your previous bets have failed)! But did I say it would win by a large difference, like you? Even the trashy goal.com predicted a 2-1 home loss to PSG! Why are you only answering now? It's because of me? Lol. I never expected you te be this troll...

Author: Malko
Date: 06-10-2012, 16:36
Edited by: Malko
at: 06-10-2012, 16:53

The points given to germany and Franc in direct confrontation:.

If a lower ranked team wins, it gets the points which is different in the accurate ranking in the 2 leagues with a minimum of 3 points and a maximum of 17 (because Bundesliga only has 18 teams).
If a higher ranked team wins, it gets 3 points

.In case of a draw, the lower ranked team gets half of those points with a minimum of 1.

. The ranking is always the position in the domestic league the moment of the game.

This means after the first game Schalke-Montpellier:

France : 5
Germany : 0

Bayern can change that scoring vs Lille

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Malko Date: 06-10-2012, 16:37 Edited by: Malko at: 06-10-2012, 16:44	Afonso, i never do anything "because of you". But what has this to do with germany vs France?

Re: Germany vs France
Author: UploaderAfonso Date: 06-10-2012, 16:52 Edited by: UploaderAfonso at: 06-10-2012, 16:56	Really? And what does Germany have to do with the battle for the 5th place in the uefa ranking? I wasn't even the first to talk about this game here...

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Malko Date: 06-10-2012, 16:53	Cause Germany will in some years battle for that rank :-)

Re: Germany vs France
Author: UploaderAfonso Date: 06-10-2012, 16:56 Edited by: UploaderAfonso at: 06-10-2012, 16:57	Lol, as if that was even a valid argument. You wish!

Author: Rienk
Date: 06-10-2012, 17:57

1 Spain 13.312 17.928 18.214 20.857 6.142 76.453 7/ 7
2 England 15.000 17.928 18.357 15.250 5.714 72.249 7/ 7
3 Germany 12.687 18.083 15.666 15.250 4.928 66.614 7/ 7
4 Italy 11.375 15.428 11.571 11.357 4.916 54.647 6/ 6
5 France 11.000 15.000 10.750 10.500 4.916 52.166 6/ 6
6 Portugal 6.785 10.000 18.800 11.833 4.583 52.001 6/ 6
7 Ukraine 16.625 5.800 10.083 7.750 5.000 45.258 4/ 6
8 Netherlands 6.333 9.416 11.166 13.600 2.785 43.300 3/ 7
9 Russia 9.750 6.166 10.916 9.750 4.083 40.665 4/ 6
10 Belgium 4.500 8.700 4.600 10.100 4.300 32.200 3/ 5

This shows Germany was better in the last 5 years and still is this year. These are the facts Malko and you can't change it.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: UploaderAfonso Date: 06-10-2012, 18:10 Edited by: UploaderAfonso at: 06-10-2012, 18:19	And what did I said about it? LOL.

Author: Malko
Date: 06-10-2012, 19:05

Let's come back to the present....

Schalke-Montpellier 2-2 (equal teams , no?)

and today :
Schalke - Wolfsburg 3-0
Montpellier - Evian Thonon Gaillard 2-3

Evian is 18th in Ligue1, Wolfsburg is 17th in Bundesliga

Really this seems to confirm that the lower teams in France are much better than the lower teams in Bundesliga.
I would have liked to see Evian vs Wolfsburg today. Probably not a 4-0, but i think Evian would win it easily.

BTW : In "Kicker", the Germans say "Schalke betreibt Frustabbau", so that if they should be frustrated not to have won vs Montpellier. ....typical. They can be happy Montpellier was reduced to 1o for 35 minutes, i think.

Author: SirHenri
Date: 06-10-2012, 23:36

Of course they are frustrated not to beat a very bad Montpellier, who scored twice out of 3 chances, while Schalke gave away about 15 opportunities. That sucks, of course.

So the 2-3 of Montpellier today shows not how good the french league is, it proofs, who bad the french champion plays this year.

If everything runs normal, Montpellier will not have the luck again, to get any further point in the CL-group.

Author: Malko
Date: 07-10-2012, 09:38

Sir henri, Montpellier had more ball possession than Schalke. schalke shot more to the goal, but blindly, like in Bundesliga.
Remember, Marseille in Dortmund last year also didn't hoot as often, but when they shot, they scored. It's called efficiency.
Montpellier controlled the game, and if they would have 11 , Schalke would have lost. What they'll do in the second game.
Yesterday, Evian Thonon Gaillard did a very good game. You like it or not. There are no poor teams in Ligue1 like in Bundesliga.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: SirHenri Date: 07-10-2012, 10:50	we'll see who wins in Montpellier and who progresses. I have bet 50 Euros on Schalke before groupstage (on reaching KO-Stage). Easy money ;-)

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Malko Date: 07-10-2012, 11:18	...for the bookmakers ;-)

Author: greenbay
Date: 07-10-2012, 12:10

Bundesliga could outscore Ligue 1 for another five years.
Malko would still argue that Ligue 1 is better.

On top of that, Bundesliga teams could win all direct matches in the next five years against Ligue 1 teams.
Malko would still argue that Ligue 1 is better.

We all know that. And that's funny. I like that. I like this forum. It's always good to have the court jester around. We all need a lough a day.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 07-10-2012, 12:12	I actually think Schalke can win or draw at the Emirates.

Author: Malko
Date: 08-10-2012, 19:28

greenbay, but Bundesliga clubs DO NOT win direct confrontations vs Ligue 1 clubs regularly.
and teams like Evian or Freiburg even do not play european competitions. So no UEFA-ranking to tell about them, only the games they play vs Topteams which can give us a hint. and there it seems that the french teams are more competitive.....even if i see Moenchengladbach yesterday, which won vs Frankfurt, while vs fenerbace there was no problem. Marseille drew in istanbul, but we cannot judge a small team vs Marseille this weekend, cause Marseille played PSG.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Rienk Date: 25-10-2012, 13:13	Well a good CL week for the Germans Average for the French. Bayern: 1st place with 2 others Dortmund: 1st in group of death Schalke: 1st in group where Montpellier is last.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: AlanK Date: 25-10-2012, 14:11	@Rienk: Well, Bayern is indeed even on points with Valencia and BATE, and I truly believe they will finish first in group, but . . . right now, anyway you slice it, they are third in group!

Re: Germany vs France
Author: behdai Date: 25-10-2012, 18:01	In head to head games, german teams have a slight edge recently. FRA-GER: This season: Points: 1-3 & Goals: 2-3 Last season: Pts: 4-4 & Gls: 6-6 2011: 4-4 & 2-4

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Nixda Date: 25-10-2012, 18:12	@AlanK As there are only official tiebreaker rules AFTER all matches you can rank them with the tiebreaking criterias of your own choice. Mainly tho there are two solutions most valid: you can say they are tied 1st (only seeing points as there are no home/away match pairs) or 3rd (if you check the GD/GS)

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Cloakmaster Date: 26-10-2012, 06:12	Malko is right as always German teams like Bayern or Mönchengladbach are inferior to french teams like Lille and OM in every single aspect. It is just the ref's, the weather and the time-space-continuum that still don't know about this.

Author: greenbay
Date: 26-10-2012, 08:27
Edited by: greenbay
at: 26-10-2012, 08:29

I think we can close this thread. Thanks to the biased refs bribed by the Germans, the always bad weather in Germany, the too low ball pressure on this side of the Rhine, the German greenkeepers mowing the lawn in the wrong direction, the German fans being unfair, the German TV stations putting up wrong stats ... and of course the space-time-continuum invented by German Albert Einstein ... the battle between Germany and France is over for at least the next five years. Germany now have only Portugal to fear, they can probably grab the #3 spot in 2015, for a single season, before returning it in 2016. At least that's today's most likeliest prediction for any threat to #3 for Germany in the next five years. But no Italy and especially no France. Game over, Malko...

Author: SirHenri
Date: 26-10-2012, 09:50

lol guys, brilliant :-D

Seriously, I have to add, that Germany now (after this 3rd MD) is up with nearly 2,000 points vs. Portugal in the 2015 ranking, so that was a huge step to secure 3rd place, I don't think Portugal can hold up in any way this season with Germany. All teams except Porto are more or less in danger to reach KO-stage, so they will lose more and more points, at least in spring.

And as u said, all other season n the next years are secured already :-)

Re: Germany vs France
Author: caravaj Date: 26-10-2012, 10:18	In fact this topic was a German monologue, with a brilliant sparring partner from Luxembourg (look that's irony), sort of "look how we are strong", very relevant with the German position in Europe.

Re: Germany vs France
Author: DIMA1983 Date: 26-10-2012, 11:08	Where is Malko? Germany teams win all France teams. Where is Malko?

Re: Germany vs France
Author: Lorric Date: 26-10-2012, 15:57	Malko still weeps in a corner somewhere.

Author: AlanK
Date: 26-10-2012, 17:24

@Nixda:

Well, what you say is true--you could list tied teams alphabetically at this point.

But whoever is in charge picks the criteria that are actually used. So while you're right, in this case the criteria are in the hands of the Uefa, so they do it the way they prefer.

I realize the different ways of handling this make for solid confusion--in Spain, it's GD until the outcome of the overall between tied teams is known, and then it changes! In Portugal, it's GD unless the teams have played each other even once; then it's H2H GD. (Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.) Ain't life grand!!