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Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: ANDYMC10 Date: 04-05-2006, 15:01 Edited by: ANDYMC10 at: 04-05-2006, 15:01	I think that the winners of the UEFA Cup if they have not qualified through their league should get a place in the Champions League as a prize. I do not think the big clubs in the UEFA cup treat it seriously enough and if you asked them win the UEFA Cup or qualify for the Champions League, I know they would choose qualification for the CL. This is wrong and needs to be addressed. Opinions?

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: STK Date: 04-05-2006, 16:04	If you mean CL spot with direct access in copmpetition i would say NO. I don't want to see a bigger injustice than the one already exist. But if you mean a CL spot in the qualification rounds and no team with direct access, i totally agree, even for both finalists.

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions Leag
Author: bert.kassies Date: 04-05-2006, 16:10	Also if that would lead to 5 or 6 clubs from one of the top-3 ranked countries?

Author: STK
Date: 04-05-2006, 16:17
Edited by: STK
at: 04-05-2006, 16:20

You don't have necesarely to have 5-6 teams. You can establish a maximum of 8 teams 4 and 4 / country. And in this case the place 4th from a country that would have CL access would be replace by the CUP WINNER, and the place 4th should play in UC, with places 5,6,7 (4 teams). Place 8 out. If place 4th is ocupied by another trophy winner (let's say Arsenal) then place UC WINNEE shoul replace place 3rd, this one going in UC ... The ideea is to mentain 4 teams per country in each competition with any cost. Because 4 is more than enough. And maby 5 per UC, but the aditional spot to be reservated only to the teams that go for intertoto.

Author: spoonman
Date: 04-05-2006, 17:09

I'm strongly against this. Champions League and UEFA Cup are two separate competitions. If the winner of the UEFA Cup qualifies for the CL through the national championship, that's fine. If they don't, then there's no reason to "promote" them by using just another obscure and arbitrary rule.

UEFA has already invented enough of these rules (e.g. "relegating" 3rd place CL teams to UEFA Cup) so that a lot of people now see the UEFA Cup as being Europe's "2nd division". But it isn't. At least it shouldn't be.

What's the use of a European Cup competition when you know from the start that the title holder will never ever come back to defend his title?

Author: STK
Date: 04-05-2006, 17:22
Edited by: STK
at: 04-05-2006, 17:24

Ok, we only express our own opinions here. I don't think that UEFA has a plan in this direction. But what is your opinion about the teams that came from CL in UC, either qualification, either group stage? If UC recive such a high amount of average teams, is not normal that CL to recive UC finest too? Don't agree that this will increase his value?

I agree with you, there are 2 different competition, any teams exchange is kind of pointless, but you don't find unappropiate that the teams are comming just from one direction? And this not to increase UC value, but to diminish his value and the UC natives are kind of disadvantaged. Think also to the fact, that giving the winners a CL spot, will increase the interest for UC, what you say about that?

And one last fact, teams that came from CL in UC play in 2 competition in the same season. The UC winner will win a spot only for next season.

Author: spoonman
Date: 04-05-2006, 17:42
Edited by: spoonman
at: 04-05-2006, 17:43

STK, I see what you mean but all this doesn't convince me. Personally, I think that every way of teams crossing from one competition to another within the same season is inappropriate. Alas, almighty UEFA has decided otherwise and I guess we can't turn back the clock. But I just don't want things to get mixed up even further.

And I still can't see how a CL spot for the UC title holder would benefit the UEFA Cup. When you're somewhere in the middle of the season (let's say, in UC group stage) you can't say: "Okay, we'll take the UC very, very seriously now and win it, then we don't have to finish at the top of our domestic league." This would only be possible if you had already reached the semifinals. And even now every "big club" will take a UC semifinal seriously once they've reached it.

Author: badgerboy
Date: 04-05-2006, 20:30

I'm proposing four additional CL spots to go to the four best performing teams in BOTH of the previous season's European competition.

Four team maximum is pants imho so that goes. Based on this season's results Arsenal (if they lose the final) or Tottenham (if Arsenal win it) plus the two UEFA Cup finalists (assuming Sevilla don't qualify through La Liga) plus Villarreal as CL semi-finalists would start in next season's QR1. Next in line would be the losing UEFA Cup semi-finalists (the best being decided on coefficient points obtained in the event of one place only being available).

I would also abolish the transfer of teams from the CL Group Stage BUT allow ALL teams eliminated in the qualifying rounds a second chance in the UEFA Cup.

I see no problem in allowing the UEFA Cup winner into the CL. Why should this detract from that competition? Is the FA Cup diminished because the winner qualifies for the UEFA Cup rather than being allowed to stand alone? Is the Premiership diminished because the winner qualifies for the Champions League? No to both - so why think of the UEFA Cup differently?

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: walter-wade Date: 04-05-2006, 20:40	Very good idea just like they do in basketball as the winner of Uleb Cup goes to the Euroleague in next season...

Author: dawgs
Date: 05-05-2006, 05:37
Edited by: dawgs
at: 05-05-2006, 05:41

I don't like the idea for the same reason that spoonman has already mentioned - I want to see a stop w/ this mixing of the two competiitons. If you lack motivation to win and make your supporters happy w/ some nice football - then just don't show up and that's that.

@badgerboy
The situation will be more acurately reflected, if the Vans' Trophy (if there is still such a thing) winner gets a berth in the Premiership.

Author: Nick
Date: 05-05-2006, 08:02
Edited by: Nick
at: 05-05-2006, 08:03

The idea is terrible. This would be the perfect way to devaluate the UEFA Cup even further. The good news is that UEFA won't do this at least for now. The introduction of centralized marketing in the UEFA Cup for this season is a good sign that UEFA wants to raise the prestige of the tournament to it's old levels which is a good thing. Now they only need to stop this stupid "relegation" of CL teams after the winterbreak and everything will be fine

Author: Ricardo
Date: 05-05-2006, 09:18

Now all Uefa still has to do is bring in some big names in the UefaCup. They currently all are in the CL, so there is only 1 way: decrease the number of teams per country, so more top teams will fail to qualify.
Then make the UefaCup as attractive as the CL (start with a groupstage) and bring in the money centraly, then the top teams wouldn't mind so much playing 'just' the UefaCup. Maybe the winner of such a grouop should be rewarded (in money) with close to the same money as an average CL-team!

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: panda Date: 05-05-2006, 10:53	Good point, Ricardo. If you decreased the number of teams per country in CL, then by definition UC would have more 'big' teams and a more glamorous GS. But probably the big clubs already have too much power to think laterally like this - for them the CL is a safe bet already in terms of revenue, they will just try and protect their larger number of places there.

Author: Lyonnais
Date: 05-05-2006, 15:45

I agree that UCL and UEFA Cup are two different competitions and there is no need to make another cross between these 2.

However, my understamding being that the UEFA suffers from a lack of interest from fans, it might be a way to boost the interest of the clubs to play seriously this competition. Maybe.

I would rather give the UEFA Cup holder, as an award, a place to the World Club Championship. This tournement is currently played with 6 teams. Should FIFA increase it to 8 teams and presumably allow UEFA and CONMEBOL to get 2 teams, then the second European seat could be awarded to the UEFA Cup winner.
It would be a nice incentive for the UEFA Cup winner (able maybe to fuel the interest for the competition) and this would be as much as fair as giving it to the Champions League runner-up.

Author: FrancoisD
Date: 05-05-2006, 16:44

There's an easy solution to enhance UEFA Cup : all CL participants qualify for later stages, just like clubs from the best league qualify for later stages of domestic competition.

For example: with 48 teams in CL you could make them enter in round of 128 teams. Or you can make starting round depend on CL group stage ranking.

Instead of various qualification rounds, you have 3 possible entry rounds:
- Intertoto (helps solving access list defaults),
- UC R1 normal,
- UC R3or4 for CL participants.

Combined with introduction of 2nd group stage in CL, until play-offs, I think it would remove the impression that UC is "2nd division, for losers".

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: bigdunc Date: 11-05-2006, 22:25	Uefa cup winners should go in champions league but only if they played in the uefa cup 1st round.

Re: Winners of UEFA Cup directly to Champions League
Author: STK Date: 11-05-2006, 22:31 Edited by: STK at: 11-05-2006, 22:33	Only if the play in the qualification rounds in this season, either CL, either UC?

Author: drewvkamp
Date: 11-05-2006, 23:26

The way I see it, if the Champions League is supposed to be a competition between "champions", then winning the previous season's UEFA Cup should count as a path to entry.

Consider: a team entering in the UEFA Cup 1st round (as both finalists did) will play 15 matches to win the cup. That amounts to half a season for some leagues. Not a lot, but more than the average national cup.

Currently, Anderlecht (the Belgian champion) is the last automatic entry into the group stage. On average, Jupiler League members have a coefficient of 14.981 (Only Anderlecht and Club Brugge have a coefficient over 20). On the other hand, teams in the UEFA Cup 1st round this season had an average coefficient of 23.054, with 37 of 80 having a coefficient over 20. Even if one removes the CL also-rans in the first round, the average is still 22.264 for the UEFA Cup 1st rounders.

Does the Belgian champion deserve a Champions League spot more than the UEFA Cup Winner? One could make a strong case that the UEFA Cup is a much more demanding competition.

My recommendation would be to separate the two competitions during the season: no more "consolation" spots for CL losers. However, the winner of the UEFA Cup should get an automatic group stage berth to the Champions League the next season. Winning the UEFA Cup should be a BIG DEAL.