Forum

xml	No replies possible in the archive

Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: martinjt Date: 08-09-2005, 20:08	The obvious answer may be that it is a small country, but how does it explain them being worse than Liechtenstein, with a population a tenth of its size? Also, small countries such as Iceland, Cyprus and Andorra have enjoyed more success, and Malta have just drawn with Croatia. They just never seem to improve.

Author: Malko
Date: 08-09-2005, 22:11

Beeing from Luxembourg, I can answer you...but it would take 2 hours.........

There are many reasons, one of them is that except Jeff Strasser, no Luxembourgish player plays in a professional league abroad, and the best players in the luxembourgish league are from other countries......
The league is dominated by F91 Dudelange, which has only 1 player of Luxembourgish nationality in his best11.
If yoiu see Liechtenstein, most players play in vaduz, and Vaduz plays in the second Swiss division......which is stronger than the Luxembourgish first division (except Dudelange, but Dudelange has no Luxembourgish players).

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: stoffel Date: 08-09-2005, 22:29	The Belgian FA had made possibility that Luxembourgish teams could play in the Belgian second division, but the teams refused. The example of FC Vaduz makes many things clear why Liechtenstein is better then Luxembourg. Don't forget that FC Vaduz the last two seasons lost their playoffs for promotion to the first division in Switzerland.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: seso Date: 08-09-2005, 23:09	Or maybe it's just because in Luxembourg you earn more money if you have a normal job than if you are a footballplayer... The minimum wage there is sth like 3000 Euros right???

Author: Malko
Date: 09-09-2005, 14:30

About the "belgian affair", its more difficult. It was not the teams that refused, but the federation...........

About working and earning money, yes in luxembourg the average ist nearly 3000 Euro. When you are playing in a luxembourgish team, often you get a job by the team too. Therefore, many foreign (french, belgian, german) players come from 3 or 4th division of their country rather in Luxembourg 1st division. First, they get more money to play football...and besides...a job in Luxembourg! (There are jointventures between the clubs and the societies...).....

A very big problem is too the mentality of the luxembourgish players. as soon as they score one or two goals, they think they are Beckham, Figo or Pauleta.......

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: vakho Date: 09-09-2005, 15:13	Intersting how title of this topic can be treated. I guess under "poor" author mean "weak". Otherwise Lux is reachest country in EU according to staistics

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: keir Date: 09-09-2005, 18:59	"Otherwise Lux is reachest country in EU according to staistics", vakho, what does this mean? Luxembourg are obviously unlucky in terms of their footballing heritage, is there any footballing history in the principality?

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Malko Date: 09-09-2005, 19:02	Luxembourg is not a principality, but a Grand-Duchy....:-) I suppose he wanted to say "rich" not in soccer-terms.......

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: martinjt Date: 09-09-2005, 19:50	When I said poor I meant in football ability, not financial wealth. I could have said 'crap' but i didn't want to be impolite!

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: TWINE Date: 09-09-2005, 20:04	I remember Luxembourg gathering 10 points in Euro'96 qualifiers. Including victory vs. european runner-up'96 Czechia

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: gigoo Date: 10-09-2005, 12:41	I think that Luxembourg have a problem common to Malta as well. Our players don't play in a strong league and not enough of our players play abroad in top European leagues. To be beaten 3-0 by Liechestien is a big defeat and yes, there seems to be a big problem somewhere!

Author: Skyer
Date: 11-09-2005, 13:23

I am sorry - but what the shit you are talking about?

BEFORE last season Liechtenstein was the same crap as Luxembourg! Even worse, they made tremendous losses with big account. Before this season Leichteinstein didn't get even a point in qualification rounds! And Lux - did! It even had a victory - against Austria. It was either 4:2 or 1:0 - I don't remember. So, Lux had already improved, and earlier than Leich.

So, it is a question who is better: Lux or Leich - first.

And in ANY season Lux can make tremendous results as Leichtenstein made in this season - two.

It's just the question of motivation, tactics, coach findings, federation works and decision, etc. And don't say a shit about ? never improves" - it already improved and can make it again.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: gigoo Date: 11-09-2005, 13:50	Skyer, you may be right, but I only recall Luxembourg "doing well" when they beat Malta twice, home and away. So what does that say? They beat fellow minnows? Does that make any difference? Liechenstien have had some dramatic results. True, they could be "flash in the pans" but only once maybe, but at this time, they seem to be quite consistent. True?

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Lunaris Date: 11-09-2005, 16:56	austria didn't loose against luxembourg '91 we lost against faröer (0:1), that was our biggest upset but we never lost against luxembourg

Author: Gauss
Date: 12-09-2005, 09:34

@Skyer:
You're right that Liechtenstein didn't get a point in qualification before last year, but only if you're talking about WC.
You must also see that they first time they took part in the qualification was the qualification for EC 1996. And it is really obvious that they have been improving since then. In the qualification for EC 2000 they bet Aserbaishan 2-1 and drew Hungary, so 4 points. In the qualification for EC 2004 they got 1 point (draw against Macedonia). And now they scored already 8 points in the WC qualification. And they beat Luxembourg not only once but twice: 4-0 away and 3-0 at home. I think that's enough to show that (at the moment) Liechtenstein is the better team.

Author: Malko
Date: 12-09-2005, 12:02

Having seen the games vs Liechtenstein, there is no doubt: liechtenstein is a very better team than we (luxembourg) actually, and it's quite Normal. Just One player in Luxembourg (Jeff Strasser) plays in a stronger league than the Luxembourgish, and many Liechtenstein-Players play in the second swiss league.

Believe me, the fff is asking itself what to do? I remeber that some 10 years ago, Luxembourg got 10 points in qualkifications, beating the Tchech republic !!!!!!!! Just imagine! The same team played a draw with Portugal !
Today, we are far away from those possibilities......

The most important is to get more luxembourgish players in foreign championships in belgium, France, germany.....

One thing is clear: The luxembourgish champion F91 Dudelange is much more strong than the National team.

Author: vakho
Date: 12-09-2005, 14:03

Malko is not only example of Dudelange in Luxemburg when you compare club and national team.
For example Barcelona will destroy Spain, and Chelsea will most probably humilate England, Bayern will win over Germany etc.
Interesting that in some countries National teams are stronger.
For example Czech republic is stronger then Sparta, and Netherlands
is stronger then PSV. Almost in all Scandinavian countries it is so.

I guess this has to do with the number of best players playing outside country in better leagues.
However there are some extreme examples , in my personal opinion
in Turkey Galatasaray or Fenerbahce will win over national team,
despite of fact that many best players are not playing in Turkey.
At the same time I can't say Turkey has worlds best players in own league, so it depends upon country

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: thrasher Date: 14-09-2005, 04:30	I would like to see a combined Dutch/Belgium/Luxembourg league. And if that's not possible, why can't the top 2 or 3 teams from Luxembourg join the Belgium top league. Will make the Belgium league more interesting...

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: keir Date: 14-09-2005, 18:31	thrasher, I utterly agree: a Benelux league would be excellent, have there been any talks betwen the Belgian, Dutch and Luxembourgish F.A.s?

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Malko Date: 14-09-2005, 18:39	If Belgium and the Netherlands would make one league together, it would be..let's say the strengh of german Bundesliga. (Ajax,Eindhoven, feyenoord, anderlecht, bruges,....)But no luxembourgish team could survive in this league.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 14-09-2005, 19:45	Maybe when they let all the best Luxembourg players join 1 (new) team, then they could play in such a league. But their haven't been serious discussions lately about a BeNe(Lux)-league.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: veteran-sjever Date: 14-09-2005, 20:18	Friends! You forgot that Dudelange won vs Bosnian champion Zrinjski in QR1 this year. Maybe they are waking up?!

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: thrasher Date: 15-09-2005, 04:17	OK, Bert... we know this is a bit off-topic... But... Yes. A BeNeLux League would be great. In Holland at least some of the fans favour this idea. At least over an 'Atlantic League'. As someone else wrote the topic isn't very alive at the moment.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: keir Date: 16-09-2005, 18:15	"Atlantic League": what would that be? Just another name for Benelux?

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 17-09-2005, 11:54	@keir Atlantic League would be a League with Portuguese, Scottish, Belgian and Dutch clubs.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Malko Date: 17-09-2005, 12:18	Portuguise????????why? portugal has the 5th best league in Europe actually (netherland No7)....and you see the distances to play away inScotland???????? You see Porto and Benfica go plaing vs Kilmarnock or Patrick Thistle?

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Lunaris Date: 17-09-2005, 15:22	malko i really doubt that the inventors of this idea had in mind that these two teams would get to partizipate merely it would consist of the big clubs celtic rangers porto benfica sporting boavista psv ajax feyenoord anderlecht brügge and some minor teams who are clearly better than the two mentioned why wouldn't this be a good idea?

Author: Malko
Date: 17-09-2005, 17:19

Definately NOT a good idea, a very bad idea...because this would state the end of smaller clubs.
it's like the big clubs in Europe wanted to do too...but so Juve, Milan, barca, real, Lyon, Marseille, paris, Chelsea, ManU, liverpool and some others wouzld not play anymore in the national Championship and that championship would lose its interest! teams like Le mans live from their games vs Marseille, paris or Lyon...
It would be the same in Portugal/Belgium/Holland when the big teams would not play anymore in thjeir own Championship.

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: Forza-AZ Date: 17-09-2005, 17:20	@Lunaris Distances are much to big. Teams will have to travel a large distance many times in the season.

Author: Lunaris
Date: 17-09-2005, 20:14

yes i know these problems, but nonetheless it sounds not that bad
of course i doubt it will hapen with the 4 countries mentioned, why should they merge?
but it could happen with belgium and netherlands alone, they just would have a promotion/relegation scheme to their normal national league
i'm not sure if luxembourg could have a team there too, as the difference is quite big
i guess a united Be-Ne league could produce some good clubs who can easily match the big clubs from the big5 and wouldn't it be nicer for ajax, psv and feyenoord to play against anderlecht and brugge regularly so that there are at least 5 big clubs in this league?

well i know it won't happen soon, but such a league clearly would benefit both countries, even the smaller ones
of course at first they start in a smaller national league, but they have the chance of promotion and then they get mayne big clubs where they can have profit off

not a good idea? you can't tell me now the travel expanses would be too heavy (you would have to travel less than in austria, even with both countries involved)

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: keir Date: 22-09-2005, 17:55	This "Atlantic League" sounds terrible: it just doesn't make sense at all. But, a Benelux League would make sense: but, as was said, Luxembourg would find it difficult to compete, except, maybe, F91 Dudelange, is that their name? But, I would assume that the Benelux League would extend throughout the leagues, with many lower divisions with teams from all three nations.

Author: Malko
Date: 24-09-2005, 13:43

The exact name of the Club is
F91 Diddeléng

translated in French F91 Dudelange.

F means Fusion, cause 1991 the 3 clubs of the town of "Diddeléng", Stade, Alliance and Union Sportive became F91.

The actual strenght of the team (which passed a UEFA-cup tour vs Mostar and failed vs rapid Vienna in the second.....) , i would state it about

between Second Bundesliga and upper regionalliga (in germany)
a faire Ligue 2 in belgium
between national (Ligue 3) and CFA (4 ) in France.....

For more of this club..see the "new" OFFICIAL website.
http://www.f91.lu/
(don't skip the intro, it's worth watching)

and the Fanclub "Fanatics" homepage:
http://de.geocities.com/fanclubf91/Fanatics04Diddeleng.html
(goof intro too)

Re: Why is Luxembourg so poor?
Author: keir Date: 25-09-2005, 14:47	But, if they can't compete in a top league, then what is the point?