Forum

xml	No replies possible in the archive

Author: Philippe1968
Date: 26-11-2004, 12:52

Just for fun, a quick ranking for 2004/05 season integrate National and Club teams.
A quick and easy system for estimate the "health" of each country.

System of calculate :
- Nationnal team : fifa world cup points x coeff 1,5
- CL teams : points / teams x coeff 1,0 (just integrate team still in CL)
- UC teams : points / teams x coeff 0,75

I know that "great" national team have less matchs in world cup but don't forget that they were seedings. And for take an example, it's more easy to play Feroe, Cyprus and Ireland at home, vs Greece, Turkey or Denmark .... and it's a french man who say that !

So now the complete ranking :

1 England 30,250
2 Ukraine 29,750
3 Portugal 29,350
4 Italy 27,250
5 Netherlands 26,938
6 France 24,521
7 Russia 22,500
8 Israel 21,750
9 Czech Rep. 21,250
10 Spain 20,875
11 Norway 20,750
12 Greece 19,500
13 Turkey 18,875
14 Romania 18,375
15 Serbia & Mont. 17,250
16 Slovakia 16,000
17 Sweden 15,750
18 Poland 15,375
19 Finland 14,750
20 Lithuania 13,875
21 Slovenia 13,125
22 Ireland Rep. 13,000
23 Latvia 12,875
24 Croatia 12,500
25 Bulgaria 12,281
26 Scotland 12,000
27 Hungary 11,625
28 Estonia 11,125
29 Austria 10,594
30 Denmark 10,125
31 Belgium 9,875
32 Albania 9,750
33 Georgia 9,500
34 Switzerland 8,531
35 Liechtenstein 7,500
36 Belarus 6,375
37 Macedonia 6,250
38 Northern Ireland 5,000
39 Andorra 4,500
40 Bonia-Hersegov 4,250
41 Azerbaijan 3,375
42 Iceland 3,375
43 Wales 3,000
44 Moldova 2,625
45 Cyprus 2,500
46 Armenia 1,875
47 Faroe Islands 1,750
48 Malta 1,750
49 Luxembourg 0,250
50 Kazakhstan 0,000
51 San Marino 0,000

Good year for Ukraine, Portugal, Romania & Liechtenstein

Bad for Spain, Greece, Turkey
Very bad year for : Scotland, Belgium

If you think that coefficient apply are not very right, tell me your proposition and I will recalculate that with your critera.

Regards

Re: 1 England 2 Ukraine 3 Portugal
Author: macaskil Date: 26-11-2004, 13:00	Might be simpler just to add the FIFA world ranking (European Nations only) and the UEFA coefficient ranking and divide by 2. Will do this over lunch break!

Author: macaskil
Date: 26-11-2004, 14:10

Done!

Nation Club Total Average Rank
Spain 2 1 3 1.5 1
France 1 5 6 3 2
England 5 2 7 3.5 3
Italy 7 3 10 5 4
Netherlands 4 7 11 5.5 5
Portugal 6 6 12 6 6
Czech 3 12 15 7.5 7
Germany 12 4 16 8 8
Turkey 8 11 19 9.5 9
Greece 13 8 21 10.5 10
Belgium 20 10 30 15 11
Poland 15 16 31 15.5 12
Denmark 9 23 32 16 13
Russia 17 17 34 17 14
Sweden 11 25 36 18 15
Croatia 14 22 36 18 16
Norway 18 18 36 18 17
Israel 25 14 39 19.5 18
Bulgaria 19 21 40 20 19
Romania 16 26 42 21 20
Ukraine 29 13 42 21 21
Scotland 33 9 42 21 22
Switzerland 23 20 43 21.5 23
Serbia 24 19 43 21.5 24
Ireland 10 38 48 24 25
Slovenia 21 28 49 24.5 26
Austria 35 15 50 25 27
Slovakia 26 27 53 26.5 28
Finland 22 32 54 27 29
Hungary 31 24 55 27.5 30
Latvia 28 31 59 29.5 31
Bosnia 34 30 64 32 32
Belarus 30 39 69 34.5 33
Cyprus 40 29 69 34.5 34
Wales 27 46 73 36.5 35
Iceland 37 36 73 36.5 36
Lithuania 39 35 74 37 37
Macedonia 38 37 75 37.5 38
Georgia 41 34 75 37.5 39
Moldova 43 33 76 38 40
Estonia 32 44 76 38 41
Albania 36 43 79 39.5 42
Armenia 45 41 86 43 43
N Ireland 42 45 87 43.5 44
Liechtenstein 48 40 88 44 45
Malta 47 42 89 44.5 46
Azerbaijan 44 48 92 46 47
Faroes 46 49 95 47.5 48
Luxembourg 51 47 98 49 49
Kazakhstan 50 50 100 50 50
Andorra 49 52 101 50.5 51
San Marino 52 51 103 51.5 52

It would be interesting to compare that list with
population and GDP.

At a rough guess the top 3 on population should be
Russia,Germany,France and on GDP Germany,France,England.

If you based the results on the last 20 years then I guess Germany would be a lot higher.

Nations whose national side is much better than their clubs -

Czech Republic, Ireland, Denmark

and much worse

Scotland, Germany, Austria, Wales, Ukraine

Norway finishes 18th in both club and national rankings!

As you would expect, England and Italy's national sides are not as strong as their clubs, while France is better than its club sides' performance would suggest.

Spain now has a strong league AND national side - but we will see when the World Cup comes around!

Re: 1 England 2 Ukraine 3 Portugal
Author: mark Date: 26-11-2004, 14:51	macaskil, the only problem with this is that the fifa ranking is a pile of s**t. They still have france at some high place although the french national team is playing a bad football (could anyone imagin that they will compete not only with ireland and swizerland but also with israel on qualifying to the WC). A better calculation IMHO should be based on the UEFA country coefficients.

Author: macaskil
Date: 26-11-2004, 17:05

The FIFA ranking is very poor - but it is all we have.
The UEFA coefficients only refer to club football, not to the national teams.

France - they are still 3rd favourites to win the World Cup with the bookmakers. Poor results in qualifying don't necessarily mean very much - as long as you DO qualify.

My overall ranking has, taking club and international football together - 1. Spain 2. France 3. England. That sounds fair to me.

Re: 1 England 2 Ukraine 3 Portugal
Author: mark Date: 26-11-2004, 18:35	There is also a coefficient system for the national teams used in the draws made to determine the qualifying groups. Basically IIRC the coefficient is the number of point the team got in the qualifying rounds devided by the number of games they played. If you look at the current standinds of the WC qualification it is quite easy to see that france is located at the 11 place.

Author: MichaelCollins
Date: 26-11-2004, 20:18

People are jumping the gun just a bit here. I mean, there are still two European nights this side of Christmas left. Put it this way - that Scotland people like to seem to dislike (poor us, sobs)

After UEFACupday#5 and CL Matchday#6 we could have 3 teams in Europe beyond Christmas! (Hearts need to beat Ferencvaros, Rangers need a point, and Celtic need to do better than Shakhtar - all feasible to say the least)
But knowing us, we could mess it all up, and have no teams in Europe beyond Christmas.

Its all too early to tell. If we want to speculate, then I see no reason why there can't be a Rangers-Celtic, or a Celtic/Rangers-Hearts UEFA CUp final. And before people ridicule that, there is as good a chance as that as there is of a Zenit-Dnipro final (those two teams that always seem to come up!). Anything can happen.

Author: akis71
Date: 29-11-2004, 00:36

we could create such rankings for national teams using the uefa model using the qualification and final rounds of wc 2002 and euro 2004 and the current results of wc qualification games.
2 pts for each win 1 for draw 3 points bonus to teams that enter the finals 1 points bonus for each time they qualify to next round and half points for the qualification games.
Although since not of groups contain same number of teams there should be a factor. For example some of wc qualification groups have 6 teams and some others 7. So the points of teams in groups of 6 teams should be multiplied to 7/6.